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PostPosted: Dec 15th, '15, 00:24 
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The gear shift on my BF5 went from finger light to a bit stiff last season, and so stiff this Spring that I could barely move it standing behind the boat and leaning on it. Something had to be done, and today I finally did it.

My previous outboard was a nasty Chrysler which had several traps for the unwary, so I wasn't looking forward to doing surgery on the Honda, but it turned out to be fairly straightforward.

The gear selector shaft enters the top of the leg casting on the starboard side and finishes inside the top of the leg, with a belcrank attached to transfer movement to two rods. One rod goes to the bottom of the leg to change gears, the other emerges from the front of the leg quite high up and engages the tilt lock when in reverse.

I suspected that the shaft was extremely tight in the leg, which turned out to be correct.

Image

Who noticed the motor is missing off the top of my outboard?
Yeah, you've got to lift the motor off the pan, then the pan off the leg to get at all this.

It's not actually as horrible as it sounds. The pull starter assembly comes off in one complete piece (unlike the Chrysler...), followed by the vertical shaft which transfers throttle cable movement to a rod to the carby and to the "not in neutral" starter lockout. Photograph this part before removal and watch out for bushes, etc which can fall off once it is removed.

The carby controls (choke cable and throttle rod) need disconnecting, as do some electrical cables on the port side.

Then there are 9 bolts from beneath which hold the motor to the pan. Lift the motor out of the leg, taking the shaft and possibly the water pickup tube with it.

At this stage, with the pan still in place, it looks like this:

Image

In this view you can see the bellcrank on the inside end of the shaft. The shaft has a flat machined, and a threaded hole. The bellcrank locates by means of the flat and is retained by the bolt and a lock washer with fold up tabs (flattened out in the photo, taken during re-assembly):

Image

The pan obstructs the outer end of the shaft, so it has to go too. The pan is held down by 4 bolts; the heads of two are visible in the photo above. Once the pan is out of the way, the gear shaft can be extracted out the starboard side of the leg like this:

Image

Assuming of course that it isn't jammed tight in there, which of course was why I was in there taking it apart in the first place. It took a good hour or so of brute force (which was very awkward to apply) to get the shift lever and shaft out of the leg.

The problem...
The shaft runs in several plastic bushes. At each end of the hole is a short ~10mm long bush with a flange, but the entire length of the hole is lined by another bush. Some plastics, eg: Nylon, swell slightly in water, and with nowhere to go, the bush had jammed the shaft hard.

It really was hard work getting the shaft out! Once I got it out, I started to try to remove the bush when it dawned on me I could ream it with a 10mm drill bit. A few minutes with the battery drill and the shaft was moving relatively freely and it was time to re-assemble, with lots of nickel based anti-seize. About this stage I remembered to take the photos you see above.

It all took me about 4-1/2 hours and would be much quicker if I have to do it again. Getting it apart before the shift lever got really stiff would no doubt make the job easier too. If your BF5 gear shift is getting stiff, fix it while it is easy to fix.

The workshop manual is here.

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PostPosted: Dec 15th, '15, 08:58 
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Would have been a good time to drill and tap a long grease nipple up from underneath for future lubrication?

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PostPosted: Dec 15th, '15, 14:15 
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The underlying problem was the bush swelling, rather than a lack of lubrication.

I agree, a better design might include a spiral groove in the bush for grease to fit in and possibly a grease nipple, but the original took about 6 or 7 years to swell up and jam, and now it has been reamed the problem shouldn't come back. It's not like the shaft spins very fast or for very long!

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PostPosted: Dec 15th, '15, 16:51 
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Well fixed.
Like you say might have been easier to fix a bit earlier, but may have ended the outboards life in, what Moodyblue calls "collateral damage" if left much much longer.
Imagine the same age ob on a moored boat. Seized power head and pan bolts snapping. Output shaft seized (BTW surprised the output shaft comes out with the power head) could have seen the job all to hard and in the bin.

A bit like lawn mowers, most die not due to engine failure, but broken catcher or worn housing, even the wheels disintegration.
I run my 25 year old 2st Victa mower (you know the one, plastic carby that drips fuel, rubber bulb you can press as many times as you like and never be sure if you got it right) clearly has 25:1 on the fuel cap on 50:1 boat fuel.
I think the wheels will fall off before the engine dies.

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PostPosted: Dec 17th, '15, 07:21 
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Nice work Zeb,

The issue I always have is why uber expensive outboards need so much maintenance after so little use, I understand they work in a hostile environ but that is the very reason they tell us we pay so much for them, because they are engineered to work for prolonged periods in these conditions, yet we have to give them a yearly service after just few hours running and they seem to go wrong on a regular basis.

I wonder how many of us would put up with the same thing from a car manufacturer? Imagine if you had to service your car after just a few hours running, or if your transmission stopped selecting gear, personally I think they get away with things that just wouldnt be acceptable in a general consumer product

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PostPosted: Dec 17th, '15, 08:14 
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Thanks for the story and pics. I wish I'd taken pictures of the similar repair to our Tohatsu 3.5 that froze the gear shift. In that case it was simply corrosion in the casting where the shift rod passes through and once removed simple to ream out and all was good. I was amazed how simple it was to get to: 6 bolts and the motor came off. The only difficult thing was replacing the gasket under the motor. Found the service shops particularly unhelpful.

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PostPosted: Dec 17th, '15, 19:02 
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Whilst Im having a whine about outboards, I needed 2 bolts for the steering bracket on my Merc, off I pop to the Merc dealer (after I tried standard 8mm and 5/16" screws without luck), he looked it up and found they are 5/16 UNF thread x 3/4" long, he didnt have any in stock but could order them to arrive after Christmas, cost of the Merc Part $7ea

So off I toddle to Dandy Bolts, bought the 2 plus a couple of "R" clips, total for the 4 items $1.70

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PostPosted: Dec 17th, '15, 21:49 
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sailboatmike wrote:
Whilst Im having a whine about outboards, I needed 2 bolts ... cost of the Merc Part $7ea

Well, he pays $3 each for them individually wrapped up Mercury packaging, all the way from the USA. They probably even have a consignment number.

sailboatmike wrote:
So off I toddle to Dandy Bolts, bought the 2 plus a couple of "R" clips, total for the 4 items $1.70

Whereas Dandy bolts pays $30 per thousand in bulk orders with 40 other sizes too, and sells enough to re-order them next month!

Were they stainless?

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PostPosted: Dec 18th, '15, 08:56 
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Yep stainless, last lot I got from Dandy Bolts was 6mm x 50 stainless round head screws with nuts, cost less than $1.00 each if my memory serves me, and they had to order them in specifically for me.

I dont think Mercury buys them in a dozen at a time, they would buy in 1000's and unlike Australia in the USA stainless isnt considered to be the equivalent of gold, so I would think their single cost would be a few cents each, the point that they chose to individually package rather than sell a bulk pack of this common bolt on the motor isnt my problem, they do that to maximise profits for their own benefit.

A typical example is my new prop for the motor on my inflatable, Its a 4Hp Merc, Genuine Merc prop $193ea, Parsun prop, identical with the same warranty $70 posted to my door

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PostPosted: Jan 16th, '17, 19:00 
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zebedee wrote:
The gear shift on my BF5 went from finger light to a bit stiff last season, and so stiff this Spring that I could barely move it standing behind the boat and leaning on it. Something had to be done, and today I finally did it.
...
It all took me about 4-1/2 hours and would be much quicker if I have to do it again.


Looks like I'm going to find out how quickly I can do this job second time. This time I'll ream out the bushes with a 13/32" (10.3mm) bit. Naturally I'll have a good look to see if there's any evidence the nickel anti-seize contributed to the problem, but I think reaming the bushes oversize is the answer.

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PostPosted: Jan 21st, '17, 22:08 
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Zeb you will probably find that the problem is not the nylon swelling so much as the housing corroding and squeezing the bushes down onto the shaft.
I've had to do the same job on one of my engines. I think it may have been the little 3.3 Merc. Not sure but that was the problem in my case. I removed the bushes and scraped out the corrosion with an old hacksaw blade, cleaned it as best I could and refitted with copious amounts of lanolin grease.
I had to do many similar jobs on my new trawler decades ago, where all of the hatches and doors had two bulkhead handles each and all had nylon bushes and thrust washers which after only their first season were becoming very hard to operate. Some of the seldom used hatches had to be operated with a piece of pipe for an extension lever. It was the same situation with all handle assemblies having been fitted dry and once the salt entered the aluminium housing the corrosion crushed the nylon onto the 3/4 in stainless handle/shafts. I had to make a special press to get some of the tight ones apart.
Once the layer of crust like corrosion was removed I was surprised to find the fitment had not been compromised and after refitting with the lanolin and after another five years till I sold the boat all were still turning freely and not at all sloppy.
Love lanolin, doesn't swell nylon, plastics etc. or make them brittle like any mineral grease/product.
Cheers, Pete.

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PostPosted: Feb 7th, '17, 21:39 
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Job done (again).
There's no sign of corrosion around the bush, but the inner bush is basically exposed to exhaust gases. Anyway I've run a 13/32 (10.35mm) drill bit through the bushes and it all moves much better now.

However...

zebedee wrote:
The pull starter assembly comes off in one complete piece (unlike the Chrysler...), followed by the vertical shaft which transfers throttle cable movement to a rod to the carby and to the "not in neutral" starter lockout. Photograph this part before removal and watch out for bushes, etc which can fall off once it is removed.


Uhh yeah, so I've got a slight problem.

Image

That's the starter lockout pawl ("powl, neutral start" if you're Honda); it is spring loaded clockwise (as seen from above) so that the longer end, pointing down to the right in this view, fouls on the starter and prevents it turning unless pushed out of the way by the "bump" on the cam rod, part #5 in the next drawing:

Image

In fact my problem is the spring which bears on the pawl, or the "spring, powl" if you're Honda, part #11 in this drawing:

Image

It is far from obvious how this spring fits.

Here's the spring in a photograph; it's the light grey spring just under the top bracket on the shaft:

Image

Here's a sadly out of focus photo and closeup which appears to show the long tail of the spring just sort of tucked up on the port side of the rearmost bolt holding the bracket:

Image

Image

And another shot which really isn't close enough to be sure, where the long tail of the spring just seems to be behind the bolt:

Image

Does anyone out there have another BF5 they could look at and put me out of my misery? A decent photo of how the spring fits or even just a written description? If you're somewhere south east of Melbourne I'd love to have a look myself too!

Thanks!

By the way, as well as the workshop manual, the parts list is available online too.

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PostPosted: Jan 31st, '18, 13:26 
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I'm losing my sense of humour over this issue.
Yep, stiff gearshift again 12 months later.

Last time I used a 13/32" (10.3mm) drill bit to ream the bushes. This time I think I will use either a 7/16" (11.1mm) or an 11mm bit; whichever I can find without having to buy a new one.

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PostPosted: Jan 31st, '18, 20:43 
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zebedee wrote:
I'm losing my sense of humour over this issue.
Yep, stiff gearshift again 12 months later.

Last time I used a 13/32" (10.3mm) drill bit to ream the bushes. This time I think I will use either a 7/16" (11.1mm) or an 11mm bit; whichever I can find without having to buy a new one.


How's the condition of your gear box oil?
(Obviously loaded question)


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PostPosted: Feb 1st, '18, 00:55 
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Gearbox oil is at the opposite end of the outboard to the problem, which is the selector shaft and bushes.

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PostPosted: Feb 3rd, '18, 08:44 
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zebedee wrote:
Gearbox oil is at the opposite end of the outboard to the problem, which is the selector shaft and bushes.

Is it?
If you separate the final drive case from the bottom leg and then try changing FWD-N-REV and back again by operating the stainless steel shaft you will see just how difficult it is to perform the changes.
Removal is quite simple, just three 10mm bolts and the shaft connector behind the rubber plug in the leg. There's no gasket, just two locating dowels, and a sharp rap with a Nylon faced hammer will have it off.
With the final drive secured to the bench, taking care not to damage it, take your battery drill and with a 12mm or 1/2" or 13mm socket (I can't remember which) spin the square drive shaft in the correct direction at about 600rpm. This will simulate idle speed. Put a few drops of concentrated liquid detergent down into the pump to lubricate the impeller to prevent damage.
Now try changing gears by grasping the stainless gear change shaft with your fingers and pulling or pushing. You will probably find you can't do it using your fingers alone and will have to resort to some kind of mechanical assistance.
With the final drive off have another go at operating the gear change mechanism using the FWD-N-REV handle and check how much effort is required. Mine was stiff to difficult but doable so I left the bush alone.
While you have the final drive off pull the prop shaft out and have a good look at the FWD-N-REV actuating mechanism and give it a good clean up. There is not much mechanical advantage in the whole system, top to bottom, so it is always going to be, at best, difficult.


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PostPosted: Feb 3rd, '18, 10:34 
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Would a specially machined bronze bush fix the problem?

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PostPosted: Feb 3rd, '18, 12:32 
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Ukuri wrote:
zebedee wrote:
Gearbox oil is at the opposite end of the outboard to the problem, which is the selector shaft and bushes.

Is it?

Yes.
The gear selector on the side of the outboard has no freeplay whatsoever and is very stiff.

Quote:
If you separate the final drive case from the bottom leg and then try changing FWD-N-REV and back again by operating the stainless steel shaft you will see just how difficult it is to perform the changes.

Or I could go in from the top as usual, and while I've got the vertical shift rod disconnected, check it moves freely like the last two times I had the same problem?

Tinggu wrote:
Would a specially machined bronze bush fix the problem?

I had a go at removing the plastic bushes first time around before I decided to ream them out instead, I need to stare at it all a bit harder and figure out why they go tight (someone suggested corrosion in the surrounding metal for example). In principle, the standard Honda bush ought to be entirely satisfactory; after all it lasted ten years before it gave any trouble, and Honda build many thousands of these things!

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PostPosted: Feb 11th, '18, 17:11 
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Pancho 43 wrote:
Zeb you will probably find that the problem is not the nylon swelling so much as the housing corroding and squeezing the bushes down onto the shaft.


And the prize goes to Pancho, back in January 2017.

The inner end of the hole the gear shift shaft passes through has been corroding and compressing the bush onto the shaft.
I demolished the bush (10mmID) with a 7/16" drill bit, thus dislodging it from the corroded hole. Now I need to find replacement bushes and to ream out the hole in the casting...

Other notes:
To remove the motor from the pan it is not necessary to remove the starter lockout from the pan. It must be unfastened from the pan, and the starter assembly removed from beneath it, but the lockout assembly itself (with assorted springs washers, etc to be lost of wrongly assembled) can be left in place on the pan. Once the starter is removed, disconnect all wiring, control rods and the choke cable, then remove the nine bolts securing the motor to the pan. Lift the motor out with the water pipe and drive shaft, remove the four bolts (and nuts) securing the pan to the leg, tie the pan up out of the way (saves removing the tiller) and set to work on the gear shift...

(I write this stuff for my future self; if it helps someone else, or even helps jog my memory to help me help someone else, thats a bonus too)
(I'm really hoping not to have to do this job a fourth time)
(I'm a pessimist)

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PostPosted: Feb 11th, '18, 17:41 
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MoodyBlue wrote:
Would have been a good time to drill and tap a long grease nipple up from underneath for future lubrication?



And after four goes at it I still say a grease nipple at the first try would have minimised the three further attempts. Jus sayin is all.

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PostPosted: Feb 12th, '18, 20:55 
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There's nowhere to put a grease nipple on the outside of the casting, but more to the point, a grease nipple is intended to introduce lubrication into a bearing or bush, whereas the problem here is being caused by corrosion of the aluminium casting outside of the bush.

I've run a 14mm HSS drill bit through the passage in the casting; I got copious quantities of aluminium oxide out which seems promising.

The local Honda dealer wanted $9 each for the simple plastic bushes (14 below) and was unable to supply the sleeve which fits in the middle of the shaft (12) at all. Plus the cost of freight from Honda Australia to the dealer, because they don't have stock; roughly $20.
Attachment:
HondaPartsExtract.gif
HondaPartsExtract.gif [ 20.08 KiB | Viewed 790 times ]



So I ordered all three parts from the USA for US$16 including postage, as you would.

I did try sourcing them locally, but they don't seem to be an off-the-shelf part. Similar nylon bushes are available on ebay, but the inner bush is exposed to the exhaust gases. My local plastics place quoted me $40 to make a pair in acetal, which is what the originals appear to be.

Having reamed out the hole through the casting, I'll paint inside the hole with etch primer for aluminium before fitting the new bushes. Hopefully I'll get something closer to 10 years than to 1 year this time around; the motor is already 13 years old. Meanwhile, if I do have to do it again, I now know how to disturb as little as possible to get in there so it's a much quicker job.

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PostPosted: Feb 13th, '18, 18:50 
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It's not hard to drill and tap into the location where the lube is needed then pipe grease there from remote nipple via small diameter steel or copper tubing. Packaging machines I deal with all have a central greasing point with pipes running off to various shafts and bearings.

http://www.lubecontrol.com.au/more-lubr ... equipment/

http://www.skf.com/au/products/lubricat ... index.html

https://aflo.com.au/products-page/auto- ... n-systems/

https://www.saeproducts.com/grease-fitt ... locks.html

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